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Greetings! - Page 2 - Toki Pona Forums

Greetings!

Community: Meet and greet, introductions, networking, gatherings, events, what's new in your life?
Komunumo: Interkoniĝo, sinprezentoj, socia retumado, renkontiĝoj, eventoj, kio novas en via vivo?
jan kuto
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Re: Greetings!

Postby jan kuto » Thu Apr 14, 2016 3:31 pm


janKipo
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Re: Greetings!

Postby janKipo » Thu Apr 14, 2016 10:02 pm

As noted, tp names try to avoid existing official tp words, so this scheme fails that test. But it does work with the hieroglyph system somewhat. I think the naming rules are probably more primary than the ieroglyphs.

jan kuto
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Re: Greetings!

Postby jan kuto » Fri Apr 15, 2016 2:50 am

I thought about existing words, and from the dictionary could only find a couple. But this is tokipona after all - i don't see any problem calling a 'letter' pi, or a 'phoneme' mu etc.. whilst using pi or mu etc.. for another thing. Surely every word will have more than one meaning in tokipona? I like it! It sounds good, to me. It would be nice to hear any other suggestions for this.

jan kuto
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Re: Greetings!

Postby jan kuto » Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:54 am

Maybe we can come up with something better?
Is there any mention of the letter-names in the official book?

janKipo
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Re: Greetings!

Postby janKipo » Fri Apr 15, 2016 12:01 pm

Nothing about letter names in pu or any other that I know of. The hieroglyphs use acronymic keywords ('akesi' for /a/, say -- though any /a/ word, including 'a', would do as well and so on). I assume for the moment that the support word for letters would be 'sitelen' but any noun would cause problems with 'pi' if anything followed, and possibly with 'mu' (and I do have my eye on 'ka' for future use). If you just cycle the vowels you actuall get a better set 'ja, ke, li*, mo, nu, pa, se, ti, wo*' So swap the vowels for /l/ and /w/ to 'lo' and 'wi' and you have a clean set, The vowels still need something , since three of them are words which could turn up after 'sitelen' to some purpose. The /-n/ solution only creates a problem with 'en', which, alas, can definitely come after 'sitelen' and in a spelling situation. But no natural solution is obvious.

jan kuto
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Re: Greetings!

Postby jan kuto » Fri Apr 15, 2016 1:44 pm

What about using using two vowel letters for each vowel? The vowels are all long/prolonged sounds anyway.
a = aa, e = ee, i = ii, o = oo, u = uu

janKipo
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Re: Greetings!

Postby janKipo » Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:33 pm

But that is not legit tp.

jan kuto
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Re: Greetings!

Postby jan kuto » Fri Apr 15, 2016 5:33 pm

oops! Please forgive my ignorance.- :)

jan kuto
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Re: Greetings!

Postby jan kuto » Sun Apr 17, 2016 4:14 pm

Right: i can see now there are nearly one hundred possible syllables in tokipona at the moment (?). So words, and syllables, can end only with a vowel, and -n.
Is there really any good reason why the vowel letter-names cannot stand for themselves: a, e, i, o, u ? I know the rules should be followed, if there are going to be any exceptions, however, couldn't we make one for the actual letter-names? The names of the letters are unlike any other tokipona names; and maybe it would not be so confusing, or unnatural to people?

... and, if we can live with one exception* for the consonant names, your suggestion of cycling the vowel endings is an elegant solution:

ja
ke
li*
mo
nu
pa
se
ti
wo

We would rarely be naming the alphabet in conversation. Could we live with 'li' being the name of a letter?
Last edited by jan kuto on Sun Apr 17, 2016 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

jan kuto
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Re: Greetings!

Postby jan kuto » Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:23 pm

toki!


Using the tokipona word list as inspiration, here is a suggestion for
a word-name scheme:(see my +++ edited scheme +++ at the end of this post)

ake, esu, ina*, jak, kal, lap, mam, nam, oli, pak, sam, tas, una*, wal

Each word is made up from the first word beginning with that letter, a = akesi, so "a" is "ake".
Each name has three letters.
Vowels made up with the first three: Vowel+consonant+vowel, VCV, combination.
Consonants are made up with the first three: Consonant+vowel+consonant, CVC, combination.

I use the first possible word in the word list to form the letter-names, but maybe one of the other words from the
list might be a better choice ( i am thinking yak sounds like a " dirty word",so maybe "jel" is better, and "pak" is a bad word, so maybe "pal" would is better?) ?.


So my +++ edited scheme +++ is:

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

ake, esu, ina*, jel**, kal, lap, mam, nam, oli, pal**, sam, tas, una*, wal

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Maybe someone could come up with something more pleasing to the ear, or easier to remember?

* i used the first available VCV combination in each of these two words (ina and una)
** jak i change to jel, pak i change to pal


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