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right way to learn tokipona? - Toki Pona Forums

right way to learn tokipona?

Language learning: How to speak Toki Pona, translation problems, advice, memory aids, tools and methods to learn Toki Pona and other languages faster
Lingva lernado: Kiel paroli Tokiponon, tradukproblemoj, konsiloj, memoraj helpiloj, iloj kaj metodoj por pli rapide lerni Tokiponon kaj aliajn lingvojn
solsang
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right way to learn tokipona?

Postby solsang » Mon May 24, 2010 8:02 am

Saluton, Moi, Hello, Dav etc

I have been wanting to learn tokipona for several years and ordered the book long time ago for learning it, yet since it seems indefinitely far off, what is a good way of learning now?

I found the toki-pona-lessons.pdf from 2005 and the http://tokipwnage.webs.com/alphabet.htm yet i also see that there are a few new words (as yet unexplained) on the official page and read some other words in this forum, being a perfectionist this is a bit confusing, especially since some ways of expressing things seem changed

Been having trouble with esperanto letters and irregularities too, to the point of almost giving up, seeing how small changes would make it much easier to learn and use for newbies, and fully understand the postponing a tokipona book until such issues as numbers or wordbuilding has found nice useful ways (i really like the simplicity of tp and contrast it to the complexity of esperanto to show the difference again to english)

I have some friends who are also mildly interested in learning it, and i would like to be sure i present the correct language to them, to feel confident i spread the right thing

Yours
Aurin (*Alin*)
Denmark

janKipo
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby janKipo » Mon May 24, 2010 9:18 am

Probably the best way to learn is to plunge right in -- on the forums on this page or on tokilili. The vocabulary is in minor flux but the bulk is pretty sure to stay the same and is easy to learn. The grammar is also a snap (even more so that Esperanto -- snicker). What will happen about the few outstanding problems will come as needs to relearn for all of us, so you'll be at no special disadvantage. So sit, whack out a paragraph in tp as well as you understand it and wait for corrections, comments, encouragement and advice. They will come fairly quickly. You'll soon get up to the fairly sophisticated (for a rustic language) level that we all enjoy here.

solsang
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby solsang » Mon May 24, 2010 10:05 am

Thanks, i will use the old lessons then, though i see the basic word noka is gone and asun replaces kama jo, those are quite big changes, since i will teach my friends i also guess the mute and ale number system is needed:)

I did a singable translation of the happy celll song, finding i had to change a lot to avoid boring repetitions, though it was really funny and i like thinking of a cell as a tiny human;)

Kalama musi pi jan lili sijelo

//: Jan lili ale sijelo li pilin pona,
jan lili ale jo e pona wawa ://
//: Mi pilin pona, jan ala pilin ike,
sijelo ale li pona tawa mi ://

The Happy Cell Song

//: Every little cell in my body is happy,
every little cell is happy and well. ://
//: I'm so happy, every little cell,
in my body is happy and well. ://

janKipo
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby janKipo » Mon May 24, 2010 1:41 pm

Cute! Thanx.

//: Jan lili ale sijelo li pilin pona,

I would have said 'jan lili sijelo ali' or 'jan lil ali pi sijelo mi' but the suggestions about the order of modifiers is not yet established (if there is going to be one.

jan lili ale jo e pona wawa ://

'jan lili ale LI jo e pona wawa' every subject except 'mi' and 'sina' needs 'li.' Possesses a mighty good" is loose for "happy and well" but I don't know a better that fits the scheme.

//: Mi pilin pona, jan ala pilin ike,

'jan ala LI pilin ike' again.

sijelo ale li pona tawa mi ://

'sijelo ale' means "every body. all bodies". I think the right way to what you want is 'ale sijelo' or 'ale pi sijelo mi' but Iam open to other suggestions. This last could also mean "I like my whole body."

Now you are a jan pi toki pona!

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jan Josan
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby jan Josan » Mon May 24, 2010 2:57 pm


solsang
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby solsang » Mon May 24, 2010 3:50 pm


solsang
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby solsang » Mon May 24, 2010 4:12 pm

Last edited by solsang on Mon May 24, 2010 5:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

aikidave
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby aikidave » Mon May 24, 2010 4:18 pm


janMato
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby janMato » Mon May 24, 2010 4:21 pm


janKipo
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Re: right way to learn tokipona?

Postby janKipo » Mon May 24, 2010 5:07 pm

The tp plan is just not to use numbers as cardinals or ordinals; the new system is just as bad (or worse) than the old one and introduces real confusions (as Mato notes). For number names (like dates and addresses), the plan seems to be just to write them out in standard decimal notation for now, although we have no way to pronounce them officially.
The only word which is not pretty well understood is 'pu', about which we know nothing and therefore speculate a lot (most of it cloud-cuckoo landish). The boundaries of the new words need defining a bit, to be sure, but the heartland is firm. Again, Mato gives a good summary, although he may include a few of his own flights, which are not official or even widely used.
The most interesting problem remaining is about word classes, noun, verb and the like. Except for the purely structural words (li, e, la, o,...) it is best to assume that any word can occur in any slot, with a meaning pretty reliably dependent on its basic meaning. The trick is to put things in their slots where they have their basic meaning and state the rules for new meanings from that. It is a fun game that circles between finding cases, formulating rules, and naming classes, with constantly shifting assignments. However, it seems to be settling down now and a fairly definitive list ought to be forthcoming in time to get folded into Sonja's book. Meanwhile, do what seems right and either you get away with it or you get criticized (and maybe you change or maybe your critic does).


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