sitelen suwi

Signs and symbols: Writing systems (hieroglyphs, nail writing) and Signed Toki Pona; unofficial scripts too
Signoj kaj simboloj: Skribsistemoj (hieroglifoj, ungoskribado) kaj la Tokipona Signolingvo; ankaŭ por neoficialaj skribsistemoj
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jan Josan
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Re: PS

Postby jan Josan » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:40 am

jan-ante wrote:ni li toki pi tenpo nanpa wan

a a a! pona mute!

1. [li]
If you come up with anything you like I'd like to see. With the flexibility there is now with simplifying and elaborating glyphs, it probably wouldn't even break any of the rules I've set up so far.

2.& 5. [tan, lon, la]
Same sentence twice, using la as a container and as a wall. (from jan Ote's Gilgamesh)"
Image

3. [o]
Happily, the old o is right out of the syllabary, so it's still usable as an alternative. I'm thinking now of a dedicated o glyph like this:
Image
in action (again, from jan Ote's Gilgamesh):
Image

6. Just playing around with it for the images above it's clear how much fun jan Ote's Gilgamesh would be to try out. Maybe once the text is stable and with jan Ote's blessing, I'll be up to the challenge. Popol Vuh is a great idea, and one worthy of other's attention. I also have a Tommaso Landolfi short story I'm working on; hopefully I can get some of the text in here soon for criticism.

7. Yes for almost everything. Some would be confusing ( e for example). Most square gylphs don't benefit from this, but the true prepositions do (tawa tan lon). Mirror flipping can be useful for assymetrical glyphs (pali waso palisa, and glyph-block ni).Be careful with the syllable glyphs (m rotates into w, j is similar to p, a would be hard to draw any other way). It is useful to rotate the syllable ni -- but I haven't decided if it might be confused with mi.

8. The block-order-rule images I did in adobe illustrator. All my script drawings are done with felt tip pens or colored pencils and scanned into photoshop. I have a couple actions I've built in photoshop to resize and save-for-web for large batches--is that what you mean by PP macro?

{edit 9/6/11: updated image file links}
Last edited by jan Josan on Tue Sep 06, 2011 11:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

jan-ante
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Re: PS

Postby jan-ante » Thu Dec 03, 2009 3:37 pm

jan Josan wrote:
in action (again, from jan Ote's Gilgamesh):
Image

as i understood the rules, first we read container, then the infix. i.e. container o should contain the predicate (may be with direct objects). it should be similar to li
I have a couple actions I've built in photoshop to resize and save-for-web for large batches--is that what you mean by PP macro?

no. i mean that (if you want the other people use your script) you should adopt some vector graphics software for this writing, e.g. powerpoint. you could build the gliph library in this format, like a clipart. also you need to solve a problem of gliphg order. e.g., to draw "nanpa wan", one should first draw "wan", then draw "nanpa", because "nanpa"should be a little bit over "wan". one can also draw in natural order, but then one should bring "nanpa" to front (or send "wan" to back). one can use macro to automate this. additional problem is related to containers. if you use a container, you can drwa in natural order, but afterwards you should adjust the size of container. i.e. the macro should not be applied to containers.may be you could consider to change the rule of modifiders drawing, i.e. place the modifier over the modified word

2.& 5. [tan, lon, la]

tan works fine

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jan Josan
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Re: PS

Postby jan Josan » Thu Dec 03, 2009 7:34 pm

As I've shown la and o, they are collecting to the right, so they are currently running as exceptions to the rules. This wouldn't be a problem, as long as the exception is consistent. Simple enough with la, but o is a bit harder since it can effect subjects or verbs. I think I'd have to choose to either group subjects when it is an address or group verbs when it is a command. Whichever is left would have to work as an independent glyph block. I've tried it out grouping the subject, so with 'jan Ekitu o moku e moku ni. o moku e telo ni' it groups an address/command in the first sentence and sits independently in the second.



I have thought about this but am not good enough with programming to be able to do this well. Making vector versions of the glyphs would be easy enough though, so I could make them available for people to try moving them around in their favorite vector based application. That would be the best way to start tackling all the layering and sizing problems you've started to describe. The obvious endpoint would be when you could type in a toki pona sentence and have it spit out in glyphs. Easier said then done :oops:

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Re: PS

Postby jan-ante » Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:27 pm

jan Josan wrote:Easier said then done

i think we should really start

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jan Josan
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Re: PS

Postby jan Josan » Sun Dec 06, 2009 6:42 pm

jan-ante wrote:i think we should really start


very nice. I see now how we could have several different styles too, like fonts sets. I found a site on-line which works pretty easily for converting graphics into vectors. I ran all the glyphs from the first 5 lessons through it, and then added a white fill behind each. I then converted each into a .wmv file, since that seems to be what Microsoft can understand. Here is a powerpoint for you to try out. If that seems to work, I can convert the rest of the vocab to make a complete set. I can make them available in other vector formats (.eps .svg) too, if that would be of use to anyone.

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jan Ote
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Re: PS

Postby jan Ote » Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:05 am

jan Josan wrote:Just playing around with it for the images above it's clear how much fun jan Ote's Gilgamesh would be to try out. Maybe once the text is stable and with jan Ote's blessing, I'll be up to the challenge.
You are welcome. The first part is finished.
Tablets with the next part are, unfortunatelly, pakala mute, so the text needs some more work to fill the gaps with a sensible, coherent content.

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jan Josan
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Re: PS

Postby jan Josan » Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:12 am

[/quote]You are welcome. The first part is finished.[/quote]
Thanks! I'll post links when I have something to look at.

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Re: PS

Postby jan-ante » Mon Dec 07, 2009 5:28 pm

jan Josan wrote: Here is a powerpoint for you to try out. If that seems to work, I can convert the rest of the vocab to make a complete set.

Image

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jan Josan
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Re: PS

Postby jan Josan » Wed Dec 09, 2009 12:01 am

jan-ante wrote:Image



pona! Here is a question mark for your sentence.

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Re: PS

Postby jan-ante » Wed Dec 09, 2009 7:06 pm

jan Josan wrote: pona! Here is a question mark for your sentence.

Image


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