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Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2016 7:07 pm
by loteni
Thanks for the vote of confidence :)

Like I said in the OP, I didnt want to get into an argument with you :P

Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 1:46 am
by jan_Lope
loteni wrote:Thanks for the vote of confidence :)

Like I said in the OP, I didnt want to get into an argument with you :P
jan Loteni, o toki!

The best is to ignore self-appointed Toki Pona missionaries. As you can see these sockpuppets scare off people not only in this forum.

Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 12:28 pm
by janpona120
Ask to explain me some details of your word list:
  • mun NOUN: moon, night sky object, star
What is the "night sky object"? I know only two night sky objects: moon and star. Another types of sky objects (like a comet or a meteor) can fly (if I know it right) not only in the night. Maybe, this semantic slot is related with a Polar light. I have no idea. PU says about "night sky object". Well, but for me it is very vaguely.

May you write a full list of things, describing this mysterious object?

Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 12:51 pm
by loteni
that is the full list. I suppose that is so we can say things like ; mun nasa - for UFO, and so it includes satelites, planets and galaxies... I'm sure Sonja had a very good reason for placing that in there ;)

Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 2:32 pm
by loteni
jan Lope :

I suppose most beginners soon realise the "corrections" offered are themselves incorrect, and after a while of trying to help, just give up, ignore, and continue on learning the much richer form of the language as it is intended to be used.

Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 8:11 am
by janpona120
mun nasa - for UFO, and so it includes satelites, planets and galaxies...
Do you say that: satelites, planets and galaxies are... night objects?... flying in the sky only during "tenpo pimeja". Maybe, we should say: they are simply the sky objects, that is "ma sewi", "ijo pi ma sewi", for example?

Another question is about beings from far civilizations. For me, UFO: has "toki ante", "ma weka" and "ilo sewi". So, on my logic: "mun nasa" has a relation to a "nasa" star or directly to a "nasa" moon.

Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:19 am
by janKipo
Yes, "night objects" is unfortunate wording, referring to the fact that these things are usually visible only at night. But, of course, some, including the moon itself, are visible in the day. Probably the old expression "heavenly bodies" would be better. Or "bright objects outside earth's atmosphere" ) "bright" being from our point of view, of course, since many are not light sources) .
Prob 'Lon sewI ma'

Re: The Official Toki Pona Dictionary

Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:21 am
by loteni
jan pona120:

"night *sky* object" -- which is the actual wording, not the mess of "night objects" that kipo misquotes and claims is unfortunate, but yeah its unfortunate that some people can misread so easily.

"night sky object", is very good wording, that would not only refer to "heavenly bodies", but all sorts of "night sky objects", including ones within our atmosphere.

by UFO -- I meant "unidentified", not an already agreed upon outer space visitor; hence mun nasa ; a strange night sky object -- maybe its venus, maybe its alien visitors in an advanced craft, maybe its a comet... you merely communicate; some strange thing in the night sky.

Also maybe we should just try to understand the actual language, instead of making one ourselves. In Toki Pona, there is a heavy emphasis on personal subjectivity, people speak from their own perspectives, not from a view of "God". Hence these things are generally only visible in the sky at night.
The logic of language is very different to how you seem to conceive of it to be. We do not speak in propositional logic, language can encapsulate that but it is more richer and more nuanced, generally we speak using these riches and nuances so as we can express more information with less words.