"moku lipu suwi" pi tan jan Apensen en jan Mu

[jan_Anti]

mi sitelen e toki "moku lipu suwi" pi tan jan Apensen en jan Mu kepeken toki pona. toki ni li tan tenpo pini. jan ala li jo e ona. tan ni la, jan ali li ken kepeken e ona.

nimi soweli li ken ike: 'waso meli/mije' (chicken/rooster), 'waso kala (/telo?)' (duck), 'waso Kanata meli/mije' (goose/gander), 'soweli pi nena suli' (pig). sina pilin seme?

mi pilin e ni: toki ni li ken pona tawa jan sin. kulupu nimi sama li kama lon tenpo mute.

toki Inli la: http://oaks.nvg.org/ntales1.html
toki Nosiki la: http://runeberg.org/folkeven/005.html

moku lipu suwi

tenpo la meli li jo e jan lili luka tu pi wile moku. ona li pali e moku lipu suwi tawa ona mute. ona li kepeken e telo mama soweli sin. moku li lon insa pi poki pi sewi seli li kama suli en pona. jan lili ali li lon poka mama. mama mije li lukin.

jan lili pi nanpa wan li toki e ni: "mama o pana e moku lili tawa mi. mi wile moku mute."

jan lili pi nanpa tu li toki e ni: "sina pona o".

jan lili pi nanpa tu wan li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa tu tu li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka wan li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka tu li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute mute mute mute o". jan ali li wile e moku lipu suwi. ona li pona lukin mute li wile moku.

mama meli li toki e ni: "a, jan lili mi o awen taso! moku li anpa e poka sewi ona la, sina ali li kama jo e moku. o lukin! ona li suli li pona."

moku li kute e ni la, ona li monsuta pilin. ona kin li anpa e poka sewi ona li wile lon insa ala poki ; taso ona li tawa anpa lon poka ante. ona li seli lili e ona li kama kiwen la, ona li tawa lon insa ala lupa kepeken nasin sike.

"a! a!" poki moku pi lon insa luka la, mije li alasa pi tenpo lili e ona. jan lili li lon monsi meli li tawa. mije li tawa li lon monsi pi jan lili.

jan ali li alasa e moku li toki wawa e ni: "a! o awen! o alasa e ona! a!" taso moku li tawa li tawa. ona li ken tawa pi tenpo pi lili mute. tenpo lili la, jan li ken ala lukin e moku. tawa la, moku li lukin e mije ante.

mije li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, toki!"

moku: "mije o, toki a!"

mije: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso meli.

waso li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso meli o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso mije.

waso li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso mije o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso kala.

waso li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso kala o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli e waso mije. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso Kanata meli.

waso Kanata li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso Kanata meli o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli e waso mije e waso kala. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso Kanata mije.

waso Kanata li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso Kanata mije o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli e waso mije e waso kala e waso Kanata meli. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e soweli pi nena suli.

soweli li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "soweli o, toki a!" moku li open tawa pi tenpo pi lili mute.

soweli: "o tawa ala! sina wile ala tawa pi tenpo lili. mi tu ken tawa poka. ni li pona mute tawa mi tu." ni li pona kute tawa moku lipu. ona tu li pali e ni. tenpo la, ona li lukin e telo. ni li ike ala tawa soweli tan ni: ona li ken tawa kala. taso moku li ken ala tawa kala.

soweli li toki e ni: "o tawa lon nena mi. mi pana e sina tawa ma pi lon poka ante."

moku lipu li pali e ni.

"mu!" soweli li moku e moku lipu. moku li pini. tan ni la, toki kin li pini.

[janSilipu]

The trick with compound expressions, like references to animals here, is to set up a clear case early on and then use short forms thereafter. So a hen might be waso tomo meli pi moku sike, say, at first, then just waso tomo thereafter if that is enough to distinguish from other critters -- waso telo and waso nasa in this case.

[janKipo]

tenpo la meli li jo e jan lili luka tu pi wile moku. ona li pali e moku lipu suwi tawa ona mute. ona li kepeken e telo mama soweli sin. moku li lon insa pi poki pi sewi seli li kama suli en pona. jan lili ali li lon poka mama. mama mije li lukin.

A purist might insist that these were pan, not moku, but moku works fine. I’m not sure that tp has high heat or just much heat (or maybe some other idiom altogether). These are German pancakes (in American terms), not flapjacks, but the English has them fried, not baked . I miss the rapture at the beauty of the cakes in progress (which would not be visible in the oven).

jan lili pi nanpa wan li toki e ni: "mama o pana e moku lili tawa mi. mi wile moku mute."

jan lili pi nanpa tu li toki e ni: "sina pona o".
“Oh good you” a vocative? Yes, I see. This is a nice progression; probably – given the shortage of good words in tp – better than a more literal trl.

jan lili pi nanpa tu wan li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa tu tu li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka wan li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka tu li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute mute mute mute mute o". jan ali li wile e moku lipu suwi. ona li pona lukin mute li wile moku.

ona seems to change from the kuchen to the kinder at li

mama meli li toki e ni: "a, jan lili mi o awen taso! moku li anpa e poka sewi ona la, sina ali li kama jo e moku. o lukin! ona li suli li pona."

Downs its up side, nice for “flip”

moku li kute e ni la, ona li monsuta pilin. ona kin li anpa e poka sewi ona li wile lon insa ala poki ; taso ona li tawa anpa lon poka ante. ona li seli lili e ona li kama kiwen la, ona li tawa lon insa ala lupa kepeken nasin sike.

Monsuta hasn’t settled yet; I’m taking it (now; I change) to be “be afraid” all by itself, so not needing pilin.

"a! a!" poki moku pi lon insa luka la, mije li alasa pi tenpo lili e ona. jan lili li lon monsi meli li tawa. mije li tawa li lon monsi pi jan lili.

Meli li alasa (and maybe just ‘tawa monsi’ or some such, it isn’t lost yet). The condition here modifies ‘meli’, not the sentence, so I am not sure it is legitimate, probably three predicates here meli li a a! li jo e poki moku lon (?) luka li alasa (or whatever) wawa e moku

jan ali li alasa e moku li toki wawa e ni: "a! o awen! o alasa e ona! a!" taso moku li tawa li tawa. ona li ken tawa pi tenpo pi lili mute. tenpo lili la, jan li ken ala lukin e moku. tawa la, moku li lukin e mije ante.

Wawa with verbs of motion (and the like) for “fast” o pini e ona (not alasa). ‘tawa la’ ? looks like modifies subject again.

mije li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, toki!"

moku: "mije o, toki a!"

mije: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso meli.

Kama weka tan (cake didn’t throw then away) and so ‘en’ for ‘e’. ditto from here on.

waso li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso meli o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso mije.

waso li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso mije o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso kala.

waso li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso kala o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli e waso mije. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso Kanata meli.

waso Kanata li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso Kanata meli o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli e waso mije e waso kala. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e waso Kanata mije.

waso Kanata li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "waso Kanata mije o, toki a!"

waso: "moku pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi tawa li weka e meli e jan lili mute e mije e mije ante e waso meli e waso mije e waso kala e waso Kanata meli. mi ken tawa li weka e sina kin." tawa la moku li lukin e soweli pi nena suli.

soweli li toki e ni: "moku lipu o, mu!"

moku: "soweli o, toki a!" moku li open tawa pi tenpo pi lili mute.

soweli: "o tawa ala! sina wile ala tawa pi tenpo lili. mi tu ken tawa poka. ni li pona mute tawa mi tu." ni li pona kute tawa moku lipu. ona tu li pali e ni. tenpo la, ona li lukin e telo. ni li ike ala tawa soweli tan ni: ona li ken tawa kala. taso moku li ken ala tawa kala.

Tenpo la usually goes just at the beginning. Here you want “after a while” ‘tenpo lili pini’ (I think). Nice “swim”.

soweli li toki e ni: "o tawa lon nena mi. mi pana e sina tawa ma pi lon poka ante."

I miss a good word for “carry”

moku lipu li pali e ni.

"mu!" soweli li moku e moku lipu. moku li pini. tan ni la, toki kin li pini.

[jan_Anti]

@janSilipu: What would be good a term for 'goose'? 'waso nasa' seems like too much of an anglicism to me. In other languages chickens are the birds associated with silly behavior. The best I could come with was "Canadian bird", although I doubt the birds in the story are actually Canadian geese.

A purist might insist that these were pan, not moku, but moku works fine. I’m not sure that tp has high heat or just much heat (or maybe some other idiom altogether). These are German pancakes (in American terms), not flapjacks, but the English has them fried, not baked.

Right, I'll change it to 'pan' then. Since we have it, we should use it.
By 'moku li lon insa pi poki pi sewi seli' I wanted to say "The pancake is in the pan on/above the heat".
The pancakes are Norwegian ones (It's a Norwegian folklore after all, not die Brüder Grimm.), and they're fried. The Norwegian version says 'fry' as well. I have never had German pancakes, but after a quick Google image search I can say they're nothing like Norwegian pancakes.

jan ali li wile e moku lipu suwi. ona li pona lukin mute li wile moku.
ona seems to change from the kuchen to the kinder at li

It is indeed meant to refer to the children. "And thus they were all begging for pancakes, the one more prettily than the other, because they were so hungry, and such good little children." I wasn't able to come up with a clever way to say 'the one more prettily than the other'. But I obviously went wrong here; it's not the children who are pretty, but rather they way they beg. (Norwegian is ambiguous on this point, although admittedly the latter reading is much more likely. Still I got it wrong, d'uh.) How about "jan ali li wile pona e pan lipu suwi. ni li tan ni: ona li jan lili pona li wile moku."? (Running the risk of people reading it as "everyone wanted to fix the pancakes ...)

Kama weka tan (cake didn’t throw then away) and so ‘en’ for ‘e’. ditto from here on.

Nice. I wasn't too happy with my solution to begin with anyway.

I miss a good word for “carry”

Maybe if you add 'kepeken sijelo/luka (or here: nena) mi'? I feel 'pana' does the trick in this context though. And admittedly that whole phrase wouldn't be a "good" word for 'carry' :p

@Other comments by janKipo: pona. I'll rewrite the la-sentences where they're supposed to be modifying the subject. I just went a bit overboard with them since they're so vague/flexible. Everything else that I didn't comment on seemed sensible.

I'll wait and see if any other comments/critiques/suggestions tick in, then I'll rewrite the whole story with your suggested changes. Thanks!

[jan_Anti]

Seems like no one else has anything to say, so I re-wrote the story. I changed the animal names ('waso tomo meli/mije pi moku sike' & 'waso nasa pi tan ma Kanata'). 'pan' for 'moku' wherever it refers to the pancake. I added an extra 'pi' in 'sina pi pona pi mute mute ...' and 'kama weka tan' for 'got away from'. Changes that only occur once are in bold; I didn't bother overtly marking the recurring ones.


pan lipu suwi

tenpo la meli li jo e jan lili luka tu pi wile moku. ona li pali e pan lipu suwi tawa ona mute. ona li kepeken e telo mama soweli sin. pan li lon insa pi poki pi sewi seli li kama suli en pona. jan lili ali li lon poka mama. mama mije li lukin.

jan lili pi nanpa wan li toki e ni: "mama o pana e pan lili tawa mi. mi wile moku mute."

jan lili pi nanpa tu li toki e ni: "sina pona o".

jan lili pi nanpa tu wan li toki e ni: "sina pi pona mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa tu tu li toki e ni: "sina pi pona pi mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka li toki e ni: "sina pi pona pi mute mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka wan li toki e ni: "sina pi pona pi mute mute mute mute o".

jan lili pi nanpa luka tu li toki e ni: "sina pi pona pi mute mute mute mute mute o". jan ali li wile pona e pan lipu suwi. ni li tan ni: ona li jan lili pona li wile moku.

mama meli li toki e ni: "a, jan lili mi o awen taso! pan li anpa e poka sewi ona la, sina ali li kama jo e ona. o lukin! ona li suli li pona."

pan li kute e ni la, ona li kama monsuta. ona kin li anpa e poka sewi ona li wile lon insa ala poki ; taso ona li tawa anpa lon poka ante. ona li seli lili e ona li kama kiwen la, ona li tawa lon insa ala lupa kepeken nasin sike.

"a! a!" meli li jo e poki moku lon luka li alasa wawa e pan. jan lili li lon monsi meli li tawa. mije li tawa li lon monsi pi jan lili.

jan ali li alasa e pan li toki wawa e ni: "a! o awen! o pini e ona! a!" taso pan li tawa li tawa. ona li ken tawa pi wawa mute. tenpo lili la, jan li ken ala lukin e pan. pan li tawa lili li lukin e mije ante.

mije li toki e ni: "pan lipu o, toki!"

pan: "mije o, toki a!"

mije: "pan pona o tawa wawa ala. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi kama weka tan meli en jan lili mute en mije. mi ken kama weka tan sina kin." pan li tawa lili li lukin e waso tomo meli pi moku sike.

waso li toki e ni: "pan lipu o, mu!"

pan: "waso tomo meli o, toki a!"

waso: "pan pona o tawa wawa ala. o awen. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi kama weka tan meli en jan lili mute en mije en mije ante. mi ken kama weka tan sina kin." pan li tawa lili li lukin e waso tomo mije pi moku sike.

waso li toki e ni: "pan lipu o, mu!"

pan: "waso tomo mije o, toki a!"

waso: "pan pona o tawa ala pi tenpo lili. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi kama weka tan meli en jan lili mute en mije en mije ante en waso tomo meli. mi ken kama weka tan sina kin." pan li tawa lili li lukin e waso kala.

waso li toki e ni: "pan lipu o, mu!"

pan: "waso kala o, toki a!"

waso: "pan pona o tawa wawa ala. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi kama weka tan meli en jan lili mute en mije en mije ante en waso tomo meli en waso tomo mije. mi ken kama weka tan sina kin." pan li tawa lili li lukin e waso nasa meli pi tan ma Kanata.

waso li toki e ni: "pan lipu o, mu!"

pan: "waso nasa meli o, toki a!"

waso: "pan pona o tawa wawa ala. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi kama weka tan meli en jan lili mute en mije en mije ante en waso tomo meli en waso tomo mije en waso kala. mi ken kama weka tan sina kin." pan li tawa lili li lukin e waso nasa mije pi tan ma Kanata.

waso li toki e ni: "pan lipu o, mu!"

pan: "waso nasa mije o, toki a!"

waso: "pan pona o tawa wawa ala. o awen lili. mi wile moku e sina."

"mi kama weka tan meli en jan lili mute en mije en mije ante en waso tomo meli en waso tomo mije en waso kala en waso nasa meli. mi ken kama weka tan sina kin." pan li tawa lili li lukin e soweli pi nena suli.

soweli li toki e ni: "pan lipu o, mu!"

pan: "soweli o, toki a!" pan li open tawa pi wawa mute.

soweli: "o tawa ala! sina wile ala tawa wawa. mi tu ken tawa poka. ni li pona mute tawa mi tu." ni li pona kute tawa pan lipu. ona tu li pali e ni. tenpo lili pini la, ona li lukin e telo. ni li ike ala tawa soweli tan ni: ona li ken tawa kala. taso pan li ken ala tawa kala.

soweli li toki e ni: "o tawa lon nena mi. mi pana e sina tawa ma pi lon poka ante."

pan lipu li pali e ni.

"mu!" soweli li moku e pan lipu. pan li pini. tan ni la, toki kin li pini.