toki pi kalama pona suli

Language learning: How to speak Toki Pona, translation problems, advice, memory aids, tools and methods to learn Toki Pona and other languages faster
Lingva lernado: Kiel paroli Tokiponon, tradukproblemoj, konsiloj, memoraj helpiloj, iloj kaj metodoj por pli rapide lerni Tokiponon kaj aliajn lingvojn
janKipo
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Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by janKipo »

Well, I said that I had lost the thread of the story at some point, so this shows I really had,

The point about 'a' is just to reinforce that tp words -- with a few exceptions -- move around to play different roles. This case of 'a' (and of 'mu' as well) seem particularly natural moves: from the interjection to the name of the interjection, to making the interjection, to saying something in an interjectional way: ona li a e ni "mi pilin ike" soweli tomo li mu e ni: jan ike li kama. Since we can't rely on metaphors for the moment, we have to go with what we have. (Of course, I do want to use metaphors: jan li mu e toki la toki ni li sona e ala, using 'mu' for "talks nonsense" -- and 'mu' for "spam" rather than some weird version of a calque.
jan-ante
Posts: 541
Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:05 pm

Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by jan-ante »

jan Josan wrote: mi kama sona pona e toki Pasi. mi jo ala e toki awen pi toki Pasi. taso jan lawa Inli li toki e ni: jan li wile kama sona e toki sin la, ona li toki mute kepeken toki ni.
tan tenpo ni la jan Inli li pana e sona pi toki Pasi tawa mi. ona li pilin e ni: jan li wile kama sona e toki sin la, nasin pona nanpa wan li ni: janli toki mute taso. tan ni la mi jo ala e toki awen pi toki Pasi.
mi mute li tawa lon nasin li toki kepeken e toki Pasi taso.
mi tu...
mi mute li pilin lape la, mi awen poka ona lon tomo moku.
mi anu ona li pilin wawa ala la mi tu li tawa tomo moku
tenpo sike suno wan la, mi lon, kepeken nasin ni.
mi pali lon nasin ni
jan lawa li toki e ni: ona li pana e sona mute tawa mi.

tenpo mute la jan Inli ni li toki e ni:..
mi sona ala e ni: ona li lon ma seme? taso mi wile e ni: ona li kama lon ike.
ona li lon ma seme? mi sona ala. taso..
jan pona mi li pini. ona li wile lawa e pilin sina.
why sina ?
kepeken pali mute la, ona li kama pona li toki:
ona li kama pona li toki kepeken pali mute
o sitelen taso e musi sewi, tan pilin pi lon insa mi.
remove e and pi lon
pona la, mi sitelen lili, kepeken tenpo suli.
ni taso li pona: mi sitelen...
sina ken lukin e ni.

tenpo kama lili la sina...
mi ken sona e ni: ona li jo e pilin moli tan pali sina kepeken toki Pasi. taso mi sona ala e ni: tan seme?
ona li pali kk toki Pasi. sona pi pali ni li ike tawa ona. taso mi ken ala sona e ni: tan li seme?
---
to be continued
janKipo
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Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by janKipo »

<<o sitelen taso e musi sewi, tan pilin pi lon insa mi.

remove e and pi lon>>
I take it that 'musi sewi' refers to some work of art or some such thing, an object, in any case, created by sitelen, so the 'e' seems right, the 'plin pi lon insa mi' v 'pilin insa mi' is a hard call, but , since PP in NP aren't yet well regulated (maybe even allowed), I have to go with the latter for now, though 'pilin pi insa mi' also works, with unknown difference of meaning.
'pona la' "Happily, fortunately"
I think 'tan seme' is a legitimate fragment; the PP in NP is always a problem, though I am getting used to it (and still want 'pi's) My question is , why 'ken sona'? It seems he does know.
jan-ante
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Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:05 pm

Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by jan-ante »

janKipo wrote:<<o sitelen taso e musi sewi, tan pilin pi lon insa mi.

remove e and pi lon>>
you are right, i copy-pasted the neighbour.
!!! ERRATUM !!!
should be:
o sitelen kepeken e toki Pasi taso.
remove e
My question is , why 'ken sona'? It seems he does know.
i wrote taso mi ken ala sonae ni: tan li seme - but i can not understand what is the reason. like in the text
jan-ante
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Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:05 pm

Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by jan-ante »

jan Josan wrote: “kepeken toki Pasi.” tenpo nanpa tu la, ona li toki e toki ni.
tenpo nanpa tu la is not looking good here
tenpo mun pini la mi wile lukin e pali pi mama suli pi toki Pasi.
jan pitoki musi Pasi - persian poet
tenpo pini la, mi lukin e sitelen ona, kepeken toki ante. taso, tan pi toki ona li toki Pasi. mi pilin e ni: ona li sitelen kepeken toki Pasi.
toki tan li toki Pasi.
however the passage above is not from the text. in the text:
mi lukin e sitelen ale mi pi tenpo pini li kama sona e ni: me ken kin kama sona e toki musi Pasi
kepeken pali mute la, mi kama jo e toki awen pi mama ni.
mi kama jo e toki awen pi jan Pasi ni kepeken pali mute
mi tawa wawa e tomo mi.
remove e
mi pini e kon mi,
also could be understood as i finished my spirit may be just omitt this
sitelen ni li lukin sama ala e sitelen pi jan Inli.

remove e
taso tenpo ni la mi sona e ni: toki awen li pona.
toki awen ni li toki awen Pasi kin
mi lukin lon ma ale. mi lukin lon lipu mute kepeken toki Pasi. mi lukin lon toki awen mute pi lawa toki kepeken toki Pasi.
mi kepeken e ijo ante mute: mi lukin tawa lipu Pasi mute, tawa toki awen mute pi jan pi sona toki Pasi
“mi kama sona e monsuta ni:
pakala
Hajinanese
Awinu (ainu)
toki ni li tan sona wawa pi lawa sina.

nasa wawa
sitelen nasa ni li lukin sama lili e toki Alapi anu toki Po.
remove
mi pana sona e toki kepeken toki Pasi, tawa sina.

mi pana e sona pi toki Pasi tawa sina
tenpo kama la mi lukin jo e sitelen sina sin.
mi wile lukin e stsa sin
-------------
to be continued
jan-ante
Posts: 541
Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:05 pm

Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by jan-ante »

jan Josan wrote:
“tenpo ni la mi ken sona e ale,” jan J li lawa e pilin sina.
why sina?
taso toki ni li toki Pasi ona, li toki Pasi pakala.

may be li toki Pasi pi ona kin
ona li lukin e toki ona pi tenpo pini li ken sona ala e toki ni.
ona li lukin e stmi la ona li lukin e toki ona pi tenpo pini li ken sona ala e toki ni.
tawa ona la, toki ni li toki sin.”
toki ni li toki sin tawa ona
jan J li toki kepeken kalama anpa.
kalama toki pi jan J li kama anpa
jan J li pini, li lawa e kon sina.
why sina???

“taso ike suli li ni: toki ni, toki pi nimi ala, li pona kin. mi olin suli e toki ni.”
ona li lawa e pilin sina la, mi open e toki mi.
?????
musi suli ni li jo e pona ale pi kon mi.

mi pana e pilin pona ale mi tawa toki musi ni
ni li sama e ni: musi suli li kepeken e toki ala.
remove insert
“sina toki ala noki e ni: ijo pi lukin ike?...taso…”
tenpo suno ni li lon tenpo pini pona.
tenpo pini ni li pona mute
----------
how long further are you going to go?
jan-ante
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Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:05 pm

Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by jan-ante »

jan-ante wrote:
tan seme la, jan sewi o, sina li weka ala e ike ni lon mi?

jan sewi o, sina li weka ala e ike ni lon mi tan seme?
i have changed my mind "e lili":
...sina li awen ala e ike ni tawa mi tan seme?
janKipo
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Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by janKipo »

<<tenpo nanpa tu la is not looking good here>> "On/for the second time" standard.

<<tenpo mun pini la mi wile lukin e pali pi mama suli pi toki Pasi.

jan pitoki musi Pasi - persian poet>>
I suppose 'mama' is used here in the sense of "creative person." a possible but stretchy reading.
jan-ante
Posts: 541
Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:05 pm

Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by jan-ante »

janKipo wrote:<<tenpo nanpa tu la is not looking good here>> "On/for the second time" standard.
the original says "again". so i think it is better to say nothing
<<tenpo mun pini la mi wile lukin e pali pi mama suli pi toki Pasi.

jan pitoki musi Pasi - persian poet>>
I suppose 'mama' is used here in the sense of "creative person." a possible but stretchy reading.
in original "farsi poet"
janKipo
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Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:20 pm

Re: toki pi kalama pona suli

Post by janKipo »

Sorry, I don't have the original, so I have to follow as best I can. "again" is 'sin la' I suppose.
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