toki ante mute

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yves_prudhomme

toki ante mute

Post by yves_prudhomme »

OK, so, inspired by the comments on tokipona.org about how toki poniis a "daoist" language, I took a shot at translating the first part ofthe Tao Te Ching. I dunno, I guess writing a lot and using thislanguage is helping me get better at it. Or, at least, giving me agood time.Here goes:---8<---SIJELO PI NASIN PONAkin toki sona pi pona mute li nasin pona ala.kin nimi pi pona mute li nimi ala e nasin pona.nimi ala la jan li ken tawa nasin pona.nimi ala la jan li ken sona ni.tawa nasin pona lajan li tawa kan ala pilin pi pali pini palaka.ni li pali e wawa pi jan.wawa ni li pona tawa jan ale.tawa nasin pona lajan li wile ala nimi.taso toki e ni la jan li kepeken e nimi.nasin ni la mi mute li ken toki pona sike ni.nasin ni la mi mute li toki nasa ala.nasin sama ala la jan li ken wile tawa.kepeken nimi la mi mute li sona e nasin ni,li sona e nasin sama ala.sona en toki lawa en nimi lajan li sona e sitelen selo pi nasin pona.taso ijo lawa ni ala lami tute li ken kin tawa nasin pona.sona en tawa li lon.lon li jo e nasin lukin mute.ni li ken pana e nasa nanpa.kepeken e nasin pona lami mute li kama suli.mi tawa insa ala sike pi nasa nanpa.nasin ni la mi tawa nasin pona.---8<---For comparison, here's the English translation I worked from, fromthis site:http://www.clas.ufl.edu/users/gthursby/ ... ---8<----1. THE EMBODIMENT OF TAOEven the finest teaching is not the Tao itself.Even the finest name is insufficient to define it.Without words, the Tao can be experienced,and without a name, it can be known.To conduct one's life according to the Tao,is to conduct one's life without regrets;to realize that potential within oneselfwhich is of benefit to all.Though words or names are not requiredto live one's life this way,to describe it, words and names are used,that we might better clarifythe way of which we speak,without confusing it with other waysin which an individual might choose to live.Through knowledge, intellectual thought and words,the manifestations of the Tao are known,but without such intellectual intentwe might experience the Tao itself.Both knowledge and experience are real,but reality has many forms,which seem to cause complexity.By using the means appropriate,we extend ourselves beyondthe barriers of such complexity,and so experience the Tao.---8<---Here's some notes about the translation.* I took the number off the title. Numbers are not the toki pona way,right?* It's kind of difficult to say that something is not something elseif the other thing is complex. Like, in the first line, I'm trying tosay that toki [is not] nasin pona. I tried the way I said it, but itsounds instead like I'm saying that toki is the _bad_ way. Is thatwrong?* I have been stretching the "la" form a lot. "nimi ala la", "nasinpona la". I don't know if I'm doing that wrong or right. I've beenkind of matching it to mean, "in the context of", "by means of," etc.* I took "experience the Tao" as "tawa nasin pona" ("go the Tao"). Ihad for a while "lon nasin pona" ("occupy the Tao") but that soundedwrong -- not active enough. "pali e nasin pona" -- "do the Tao" --might work too.* "kan ala" -- "not-with"? "without"?* "pilin pi pali pini palaka" "feelings of fucked-up past deeds." Ilike this for "regret," and it has cool alliteration.* "sike" -- I used this before. "About, around, on the subject of."Probly bad.* I'm pretty much lost as to when to use "en" for "and" and when touse "kin." Any guidelines?* "sitelen selo" = "surface pictures" (possibly tattoos, also, right?B-)). I thought that that was a good translation of "manifestations."* "ijo lawa" = "head things." I dunno, seemed a good match for"intellectual intent."* I used "lon" for "reality." "Existence." "Being."* I used "nasin lukin" -- "visual ways" -- for "forms."* "nasa nanpa" for "complexity." "Number craziness," "numberfoolishness."* "nasin pona" for "means appropriate" is probably right, but I thinkit's confusing.* "sike" for "boundary." Not sure on this. Maybe "linja"?* "insa ala" for "outside of." Not sure that's good, either.Anyways, it's a first pass, I thought I'd post it.~YP
kurum3@aol.com

Re: toki ante mute

Post by kurum3@aol.com »

sitelen sin ni ale li pona. ni li pona tawa mi: sitelen sin pi toki pona li kama.mi lukin e pakala. taso ale li pona. tenpo suno ni la mi sitelen e toki musi pi pona kute:(All these new writings are good. I'm glad that new Toki Pona texts are being written. I see some mistakes, but everything will be okay. Today I wrote a rhyming poem:)--kili lili, tan  jan Pije--mi jo e kili.ona li pona li lili.mi moku e kili lili.--The Little Fruit, by Pije.--I have a fruit.It's good and small.I'm going to eat the little fruit.On the issue of the "Uluka" word, you said that you liked "Uluka" because it is "pona kute"... I would go for something more nasty, since Orcs are intended to be dirty and foul in the first place. I would think their name would be representative of their filth. Perhaps "Uluku" would be better. The choice is really up to you.And now some random rantings of woe, with no translation:mi pilin ike. ale li sama. mi pilin e ni: tenpo ala la ijo li kama ante. nasin ale li ike. pimeja li lon lawa mi. mi ken ala jo e meli pona. mama mi li olin ala e mama ante. mi wile tawa ma sin. mi wile ala lon ni. mi wile pana e telo oko. mi kin wile tawa. jan sewi o kute e toki mi! mi wile tawa!
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