Some missing words

Tinkerers Anonymous: Some people can't help making changes to "fix" Toki Pona. This is a playground for their ideas.
Tokiponidistoj: Iuj homoj nepre volas fari ŝanĝojn por "ripari" Tokiponon. Jen ludejo por iliaj ideoj.
jan Seloki
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Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:51 pm

Re: Some missing words

Postby jan Seloki » Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:23 pm

What about using 'sike mute'/'sike lili' for old/young
sike mute would imply that somebody has gone through many rotations (sike) around the sun, & sike few rotations.
jan pi sike e suno mute (or 'jan pi sike mute' for short) would be an old person, & jan pi sike e suno lili/jan pi sike lili would be a young person

The suggestions for taste are good.

As far as the suggestions in the image, most of them are too confusing. Especially kule.

For seasoning
Salt - namako walo
sugar - namako suwi
pepper - namako pimeja
hot sauce - namako seli or namako loje
if seli is used loje could be used for cinnamon.
人り有え人上ら人り要無。

janKipo
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Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:20 pm

Re: Some missing words

Postby janKipo » Sat Sep 07, 2019 8:13 am

Alternatives are in use for most of these
The proposals for age ,while well motivated, are ungrammatical. ‘e’ cannot occur in a ‘pi’ phrase.

jan Seloki
Posts: 23
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:51 pm

Re: Some missing words

Postby jan Seloki » Sat Sep 07, 2019 5:41 pm

I don't remember learning that you can't use 'e' within a 'pi' phrase. is there a specific lesson? Not doubting, just out of curiousity. What is the alternative used for age? Using sike was suggested long ago, but I forget who it was.
人り有え人上ら人り要無。

janKipo
Posts: 3025
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:20 pm

Re: Some missing words

Postby janKipo » Sun Sep 08, 2019 3:08 pm

Well, ‘e’ only occurs before a direct object, so only in a predicate, where direct objects are, and thus not in a noun phrase, which cannot contain a predicate (since no li’, for example). I don’t think it is ever explicitly said, but it is implicit and implied throughout. Now, ‘pi’ does not only occur in noun phrases, but what ffollows a ‘pi’ is never actually a predicate, in spite of coming perilously close.
‘jan pi sike mute’ is fine and often used. 'jan pi sike suno mute’ is also fine (both, by different routes, from ‘jan li sike (e suno) mute’ by incorporation or not). Other “age” expressions are ‘majuna’ and ‘suli’ for “old”, ‘lili’ for ”young”. Oh and ‘pi sike (suno) (mute) lili’.

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jan_Lope
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Re: Some missing words

Postby jan_Lope » Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:15 am

jan Seloki wrote:I don't remember learning that you can't use 'e' within a 'pi' phrase. is there a specific lesson? Not doubting, just out of curiousity. What is the alternative used for age? Using sike was suggested long ago, but I forget who it was.


toki!

"pi" is a separator to form compound nouns. "e" is a separator to introduce the direct object in the predicate phrase. There must be at least two content words between "pi" and the next separator.

These and other grammatical backgrounds can be found here:
https://jan-lope.github.io/Toki_Pona_lessons_English/

A Tool for Spelling, Grammar Check and Ambiguity Check of Toki Pona Sentences is here:
https://jan-lope.github.io/Toki_Pona-Parser/
pona!
jan Lope
https://jan-lope.github.io
(Lessons and the Toki Pona Parser - A tool for spelling, grammar check and ambiguity check of Toki Pona)

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