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toki pona derivatives and look-a-likes list

Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2010 4:11 pm
by janMato
Haven't I already posted something like this before? Anyhow, here's my list of tp derivatives (and just tp-like things) that I know of. Am I missing any?
(sorry for links, I can only post 4)

Toki Pona Look Alikes and Derivatives
puna- 18 words, agglutinative, CVCV phonotactices
vuyamu- 99 roots, 25 phonoemes, CVCV phonotactics ---toki IO[/url]- This is TP derivative. --- e minimal frame --- 220 words. not isolating...
tokipinglish (no longer visible on the net)- English/toki pona pidgin.
Ta ti - 2004

Natural Languages claimed to be somewhat like toki pona.
Rotokas (11 sounds, 12 alphabet letters)
Piraha (all sorts of claims, no recursion is one claim)
Damin (very few words, 150 roots)
Wagiman (very few verbs 50 verbs)
Kobon/Kalam - 90-100 verbs
... I can't find the natlang that is claimed to have only ~200 or so verbs. I should have bookmarked it. It is papa new guinie...
Taki Taki (also called Sranan) - 340 words (It probably passed through this 340 word phase quickly)

Historical Minimal Languages
Semantic primes (is this really a language?)

Re: toki pona derivatives and look-a-likes list

Posted: Mon Mar 22, 2010 5:18 pm
by janKipo
No semantic primes is not a language but rather a device for constructing a language, a set of concepts in terms of which all others can be defined (in some sense). The nearest linguistic thing to it is Natural Semantic Metalanguage, which is a set of concepts and grammatical structure types (e.g. Basic Declarative Sentence) that are claimed to represented in every language and in terms of which every word in that language can be defined in that language (definition being here a broader process than the usual giving of an equivalent expression). (check comments at [url][/url]) aUI, as a philosophical language is simple in a different way. It basically has no given words but a set of meaningful phonemes which can be combined to make up word as needed (with about 3000 examples given). Each word is its own definition, reading off its constituent phonemes. But it has 46 (or so, I can never remember the rules) phonemes/letters.

tp is not a semantic prime language (in spite of the fact I treated as one a few years ago); its vocabulary is not claimed to be complete or discrete. Nor does it set about defining all the other concepts. It just claims to be enough to get by in most situations -- with a lot of help from context and adherence to conversational conventions.

I don't know about the constructed languages said to be like tp, but most of the natural cases are underreported or fragments of now dead tongues, it looks like (Piranha is especially suspect, since it has been used to prove just about everything).