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nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:21 pm
by jan_endy
Toki. Hi!
jan lili mi en mi li pali e lipu mute kepeken toki pona. My children and I, we published a book in toki pona.
lipu mute ni li toki e ijo pi nasin suli pi jan Melin. This book describes the life of Merlin.
ona li lon / it is available at

sina toki kepeken toki Kanse la sina ken lukin e lipu mute pi toki tu.
Si vous parlez Français, vous pouvez également regarder la version bilingue.
ona li lon ni / C'est par ici ... lin_bl.pdf

mi wile sona e ni: lipu mute ni li pona ala pona tawa sina. Thanks for giving me some feedback.
sina lukin e pakala pi toki pona la sina toki e ni tawa mi. If you find any toki pona mistake, please, tell me.

jan Petelike

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 4:35 pm
by janKipo
open la 'toki e ijo pi nasin suli'; 'toki e nasin suli' ala. You can't say a path, only something about it. sama la 'toki kepeken/lon toki Kanse', 'toki e toki Kanse ala' You can't say a language either, only something in it.
no /r/ in tp; use /l/ or, if American, /w/ or, if French /k/.

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:17 am
by jan_endy
updated in post and books

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:51 am
by janKipo
Don't need with 'nanpa' + number, ordinals are treated like cardinals (recent change?)
I suppose you mean “a long time ago”, one of those undecided tenpo expressions. Your says, literally, “at many past times”. Better would be 'tenpo pi pini mute' “at a very past time”. '… jan pi tp PI lon ma Kanse...' (PP modifies the nouns, so 'pi' rule applies). '...toki e ijo pi kon en …' Really talking about air? I suppose “magic” or “spirits” and 'jan kon' are either magicians or priests. Strictly need 'nimi' before each of those quoted names, but I think the convention of dropping them is fully functional now already.
'toki Lasina' for Latin, not 'toki Loma' (or 'Lomana').('ti' is forbidden in tp for obscure reasons).
Probably just 'tawa ma kasi' “wnt to the forest” rather than 'tawa lon ma kasi' “moved in the forst” (though he probably did the latter as well).
'tenpo kama la' is “at some future time”, which might be relativized to the previous base, but generally is attached to the authorial now. 'ni pini la' “after that” is safer, I think (but this all needs some systematization work) Robert le Boron is not Chretien de Troyes as your construction has it but rather another subject to 'sitelen e toki pi jan Melin', so replace the 'li' with an 'en' (the 'li' is for conjoined Predicates, not Subjects).
My copy lacks a subject for 'sitelen e li[u mutepi jan lawa Antun'. I suppose it is just 'ona', referring back to CT and RB? (I love the pictures, btw)
'toki ali pi jan Melin pi sina sona' I suppose “all the tales of Merlin that you know” which is better as two sentences: 'sina li sona e toki pi jan Melin la ona li sitelen e ona', but at least 'pi sona sina' “of your knowledge” rather than “of wise you”.
We go round and round about how to say “is n years old” The simplest is 'tenpo n la … sike e suno' but that doesn't fit in a lot of contexts, like this one. I think we are moving toward 'pini e sike suno n' “completed n sun circlings” so, 'ona li pini e sike suno pi luka en luka tu tu' (the 'pi' is there to attach both numbers to the noun).

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 2:07 pm
by jan_endy
Dear janKipo,
thanks for your help.

Don't need with 'nanpa' + number, ordinals are treated like cardinals (recent change?)

I wanted to say "introduction" which seems to me close to "nimi pi nanpa wan", literally the words number one...

'toki Lasina' for Latin, not 'toki Loma' (or 'Lomana').('ti' is forbidden in tp for obscure reasons).

toki Loma comes from the doc of jan Pije, page 65.
To me, it seems more logical to have the same construction as toki Kanse, literally talking France

My copy lacks a subject for 'sitelen e li[u mutepi jan lawa Antun'.

Actually the sentence is cut in two parts by the picture.

All the rest is updated.

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:50 pm
by janKipo
Meli sama tu
The picture suggests a devil, Christianly 'kon anpa'. 'insa PI tomo' (th directional nouns are not yet part of the preposition – a likely development).
'tenpo pi pini mute' again. 'pilin taso' raises two questions: is 'taso' or 'wan' the better word for “lonely” (and what exactly is the difference between them)? and is the right form to follow 'pona lukin' or 'pilin pona'? I have no fixed view on the first matter, except that 'taso' seems to emphasize isolation and difference and 'wan' the singleness (not that that clears much up). On the second I have a standard rant in favor of the 'pona lukin' version, which doesn't conflict with other uses ('pilin pona' means “thinks well”, for example) and more accurately reflects the situation, separating, in the pilin cases, emotional from ethical from physical cases. But people persist in using sometimes the one, sometimes the other, with not visible reason other than calques (as I think of them – some argue other grounds).
'tawa monsi pi meli tu' is mildly suggestive, maybe 'tawa lon monsi' is less suggestive of sodomizing (I seem to be getting either squeamish or prurient).
'pilin ike tan ni' is slightly awkward, since, in that position, 'tan ni' tends to look ahead to the following sentence rather than back, but the punctuation should prevent problems and the usual 'tan ni la' for back reference is even more awkward here.
'jan pi sona mute' (just one, but very wise)
'tenpo mute' “often”, Probably 'tenpo suli' “for a long time”, but this all needs work. Probably don't need 'ijo'.
'tomo lape sina', probably 'sama'
'ona li kalama .. la ona' more like sequence than “if/when”: just drop 'la ona'
'jan ali li sona e ni: kama pi lon tomo lape' “Everybody knows this, the goings on in the bedroom” Surely this is 'jan ala' “nobody” and, since 'kama ...lape' is a noun phrase, you don't need 'ni' but can use the phrase directly as DO. …
'ona li telo oko mute' usually 'li pana e telo oko mute', not sure the shorter form works or 'li telo e oko mute'

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2015 4:05 pm
by janKipo
'sinpin pi kepeken ko...' but better as two sentences: sinpin li kepeken ko … jan lili la ona li ken kama sewi'
'tenpo luka tu la jan... suno.' and in Merlin's speech.

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Tue Apr 07, 2015 4:51 pm
by janKipo
'Tintakel' is not a tp name, so “Tintagel” or 'Tintake(li)'
'[pi] poka selo [pi] telo suli; 'accompanying the skin of the sea” want either 'lon poka pi telo suli' or 'li poka tawa selo pi telo suli' or 'lon selo pi telo suli' These two also later
'pi pona likin pi tawa ona'
'lon anpa pi kiwen suli' ('anpa' and 'poka' and 'selo' are all nouns, not prepositions). Probaby period rather than 'la' after all this about Tintagel, since it is what is, not a conditional. 'utala' is probably better 'anpa' since presumably one could fight the fortress, just not defeat it.
'olin e jan mije mi taso' (loves him and no one else, not loves him and has no other relation to him)
'Tintaken' is a nice solution you use elsewhere.
'anpa e kiwen pi suli mute'
jan li nimi e toki kon ni kepeken 'kon pi akesi kon'' (or ' jan li nimi 'kon pi akesi kon' e toki kon ni')
presumably 'jan ala li ken lukin e ante'
'ona pi sama mije ona' ('sama' as preposition)
'ona mute' should strictly be 'ona tu' ('mute' begins with three in tp)
'jan unpa ona li jan Koluwa ala' ('lon' not “be”)
'sona ala e seme'
/jan li nimi 'Anten' e jan lili kama.' (passives are hard)\
lukin lon ma ali
lon poka pi jan Melin.

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 10:39 am
by janKipo
'kama e soweli' “brought a beast” but the context suggests “became a beast”. 'kama soweli'
'jo e luka walo', 'jo e palisa...'
'poka tawa lupa'
'kama jan (sin)'
'jan kon li jan sona'
'nimi sina li seme' or 'sina nimi seme e sama' or 'sina nimi e sama kepeken seme' (she is not a name or a namer)
'lukin e jan Melin'
'toki e ijo' 'pana a kon pona' =?
'tenpo pimeja li kama la'; 'tempo pimeja kama la' means “tomorrow night”
prob best as 'kin la mi olin e sina', otherwise hard to place 'kin' with right meaning.
'awen e sina' (but this also means “wait for you”)
apparently 'kama jan kon pi sama sina'
prob don't need first 'sona', but it doesn't hurt. 'tawa sina'
'toki kon nanpa wan' (no 'pi' with 'nanpa') ditto for 'tenpo nanpa wan' a few lines later.
'kama sama soweli' ('sama' is a Preposition)
'jan Melin li pali' (strictly 'tomo' for building, but no one bothers)
I think 'lukin e insa pi kiwen suno', but maybe something else, just not sure what.
'lon insa pi poka pi telo suli' ?
'lon insa pi tomo'
'nimi e ona kepeken ni:' (or 'kepeken nimi 'jan meli...'')

Re: nasin suli pi jan Melin

Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 11:33 am
by janKipo
“Two big cuts”? As the story develops these seem to be swords, not cuts, so maybe 'ilo kapisi' or some such thing.
“Arthur forces behindly a sword”? Not sure how this works out; the crucial point is that he takes it out of the stone 'wawa e (ilo) kipisi tan kiwen' or so.
“Arthur brought a good war and brought a wise man” ? The context suggest more 'li kama jan utala pona li kama jan sona'
not clear the Saxons are a country yet, maybe just 'kulupu'.
Usual rant about 'pilin ike'
'ona kama moli'
'jan lili mije sona' doesn't mean “a known son”, as I think you intended. Passives are hard, butt here it seems to require 'jan ala li sona e ni: jan Unten li jo e jan lili mije' or so.
'wile kama jan lawa' (modal, no 'e')
see earlier. 'lon insa pi kiwen suli' though that might suggest it was inside rather than just stuck into. 'lon monsi kipisi' or 'selo' or whatever is blade or handle or whatever.
'awen lon insa' 'weka e ni'
'weka tan poki kiwen' (stone stays, sword goes away)
'anpa e luka sina' (maybe 'ilo utala' for “arms”)
see earlier.
'lon selo pi toki suli wan'
'ilo kipisi' for clarity if nothing else,
probably just 'tawa sama kon' “ran like the wind” 'tawa poka pi telo suli'
'tawa insa pi tomo tawa telo'
'jan Pelinowe kin poka tawa telo suli/ lon poka pi telo suli'
'mi wile e ni: jan Melin li lon ni.'
'lon insa pi telo suli ni' ('insa' is a noun, not a preposition). is 'selo' regularly a misprint for 'suli' or have I missed a point here about protecting or some such notion?
'luka wan li kama tan telo'
'jan Antun li kama poka tawa jan Pelinowe' (probably don't need 'poka')
'jan utala tu li kipisi'
prob. just 'anpa' rather than 'utala'